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OGRI
22-03-2011, 11:01 PM
Saw this article http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news--general-news/the-end-to-slippery-manhole-covers/17531.html

Are MAG ireland and MAG uk separate? Has this issue ever been covered regarding safety here?
Im sure most if not all have at some stage had a near one with manhole covers and overbanding.....99203.gif

adl
22-03-2011, 11:06 PM
Dunno if they are separate entities but I'll take a manhole pic tomorrow if the traffic allows. It's a fuckin' deathtrap in the making.

pawh
22-03-2011, 11:07 PM
theres a double manhole cover in town, when you come down gardner street and pass by bus aras just over the bridge on the south quays you turn left and its right on the apex, fucking disaster in the wet

CB_Phil
22-03-2011, 11:22 PM
Up by the folks theres 3 manholes in a line on the perfect line for takin the rounddy-round. Pain in the fuckin arse!
As for MAG Ireland, usless shower altogether!

Smiler2
22-03-2011, 11:27 PM
They could do with a mountain of them here.

Admin
23-03-2011, 03:26 PM
Why not put your questions to a member in here!! He is part of MAG ireland and has answered questions in the past!!

http://www.globalmotorbikes.com/forums/showthread.php?6227-MAG-Ireland-launches-new-web-site&p=102543#post102543

Hellraiser
23-03-2011, 03:49 PM
He's not really on that much, don't know if it would be worthwhile, but give it a shot anyway. Met the lad in person once, he's sound.

Admin
23-03-2011, 03:55 PM
Send a PM at him as it will end up in his email! Well thats if he did'nt turn that off in his profile!! But the mention of MAG usually sends him here anyway!!

Hellraiser
23-03-2011, 04:16 PM
Send a PM at him as it will end up in his email! Well thats if he did'nt turn that off in his profile!! But the mention of MAG usually sends him here anyway!!

Ah there ya go...good idea.

bala
23-03-2011, 06:16 PM
Those feckin big steel covers they put over big holes are also a death trap, especially in the wet. Sometimes the gobshites even have the smooth side up instead of rough side !!!

carsQhere
01-04-2011, 10:34 PM
How's it going? I don't be online as much these days alright, but I do skim the forums from time to time, and saw this thread. Sure fire away and ask any questions. If I can answer I will, and if I can't I'll tell you why not. For anyone who is not aware of the fact already, I am one of 5 people on the current MAG Ireland board.

To answer the OP's question, MAG Ireland and MAG UK are totally separate entities. Much the same aims and objectives, similar name, both members of FEMA, and we co-operate with MAG UK (and the BMF and other riders rights groups) on EU wide issues like PTI but not linked in any other way so far as I know.

As for the non slip manhole cover thing, I am not sure what the current situation is. I *think* there was a law passed a few years back on it, but I'll have to make enquiries as I don't have the facts to hand. So I'll ask around the MAG board come Monday and see what comes back and let ye know.

@CB_Phil, what can I say, you obviously have your mind made up. The way I do work is I tell it like it is. If MAG to you is a "useless shower" well so be it but I'll not be taking it personally and I wont be loosing any sleep over it.

For anyone who might happen to be wondering what MAG is doing at the moment, we're composing a response to this (PDF, 4.7 Mb);
http://www.2030vision.ie/downloads/files/en/strategy_report/NTA%20Consultation_web%20version.pdf
There's a piece on the MAG web site about it. It includes plans for more tolls/congestion charges, widespread 30kph limits and bus lane cameras amongst other things. The National Transport Authority used to be the Dublin Transportation Office and they have a track record of being anti-bike going back over 10 years. They are the main reason we can't use bus lanes.

Anyway, to summarise, ask any MAG related question you want, and I'll answer as best I can or tell you why I can't. What I wont do is get into "he said, she said". I don't give a flying fuck who did what to who back in the day. I just don't do politics. All I ask is that before you ask something on here you look at the FAQ and the position statements on www.magireland.org so we don't waste eachothers time going round in circles. Fair enough?

Hellraiser
01-04-2011, 10:48 PM
Good man, fair play! Thanks for that.

Oh...this bit here...


It includes plans for more tolls/congestion charges, widespread 30kph limits and bus lane cameras amongst other things. The National Transport Authority used to be the Dublin Transportation Office and they have a track record of being anti-bike going back over 10 years. They are the main reason we can't use bus lanes.

...just boiled my piss!!! FFS.

Anyway, thanks again.

OGRI
02-04-2011, 01:57 AM
To answer the OP's question, MAG Ireland and MAG UK are totally separate entities. Much the same aims and objectives, similar name, both members of FEMA, and we co-operate with MAG UK (and the BMF and other riders rights groups) on EU wide issues like PTI but not linked in any other way so far as I know.



Would it make sense to band together....strength in numbers etcetera etcetera?????????????????

carsQhere
02-04-2011, 01:30 PM
Would it make sense to band together....strength in numbers etcetera etcetera?????????????????

There's already a fair bit of co-operation there, especially on EU related stuff. There'd be regular contact with the MAG UK staff - unlike us, they have full time people whose paid day job is getting stuck into the issues. Aside from that, we're all FEMA members, so there is co-operation at meetings in Brussels etc. I know because I've been to one and met the MAG UK lads and they're sound.

Thing is the local & national UK issues are not necessarily the same as the local & national Irish issues. Where they are, like potholes, we'd exchange information alright but the organisations are separate. I'm not sure there'd be any additional benefit in more formal ties over and above what we have at the moment to be honest. Ultimately, we're all fighting the same fight whether it be MAG Ireland, or MAG UK or BMF or any of the other national organisations, and we all co-operate on that basis both directly & via FEMA.

As for strength in numbers, I'd agree totally, but ultimately only around 1 in 30 Irish bikers is a MAG Ireland member. That's one of the lowest representations in the EU for a national organisation. There are a lot of reasons for that which I wont go into here, although I understand a lot of them. At the last AGM less than 40 people turned up.

Lots of people have "issues" with MAG, and fair enough, MAG has been far from perfect and probably never will be perfect. All we can do is to show people that we are still there, and we are still chipping away at the issues, and sure it's up to people to make up their own minds after that.

CB_Phil
03-04-2011, 09:19 AM
Im an ex-member, still wear the patch, but unlike MAG in the uk, MAG Eire seem to be a silent entity & any petition ect for anything Bike related appears to come from somewhere else & I have contacted MAG directly before about doing a demonstration (go slow or similar protest), I was told theres no point! Not really an attitude for a rights organisation to have, if ye ask me.
Also I was told that MAG will not get involved w/politics, ie try get a minister or two to fight the cause or run themselves (I know you could say why dont I do it, Im away for 6months of the year).
Id be happy to be proven wrong & see MAG doing some good work & would be happy then to become a fully paid up member

carsQhere
04-04-2011, 09:22 PM
Im an ex-member, still wear the patch, but unlike MAG in the uk, MAG Eire seem to be a silent entity

Unlike MAG in the UK, MAG Eire have 5 part time volunteers putting in a couple of hours a week and the odd weekend in our own spare time. Linda who runs the office does a bit more as she's in there a few times a week. We do the best we can with what we've got.


& any petition ect for anything Bike related appears to come from somewhere else & I have contacted MAG directly before about doing a demonstration (go slow or similar protest), I was told theres no point! Not really an attitude for a rights organisation to have, if ye ask me.

I am all for demonstrations: http://www.irishbikerforum.com/forums/index.php/topic/68701-fined-for-driving-in-bus-lane/page__view__findpost__p__214691
I also know that you might as well be pissing into the wind as far as results from demos go. Ask any taxi driver or farmer or haulier what clogging up Dublin achieved for them. Demonstrations look good but get MAG nowhere in real terms aside from drawing in the odd member which is about the only positive benefit we get.


Also I was told that MAG will not get involved w/politics, ie try get a minister or two to fight the cause or run themselves (I know you could say why dont I do it, Im away for 6months of the year).

MAG is not party political in any way. MAG can and does canvass the support of local councillors, TD's, MEP's and even the odd Government minister regardless of their political persuasion on all sorts of issues. What we do not do is "side" with any one political party or bloc. That's MAG policy going back to day 1. If a politician supports MAG on an issue then they're in favour of our policy on that issue. Doesn't mean MAG endorses that politicians party in any way shape or form.


Id be happy to be proven wrong & see MAG doing some good work & would be happy then to become a fully paid up member

We've put our achievements on the web site. MAG works hard, but sometimes the results are invisible. You don't have to wear compulsory High Viz clothing. Yet. You might soon, because MAG may well loose the argument with the RSA on that one. Trouble is you can't see our success on issues like that (or the bike clamping we've so far prevented) because the "bad stuff" has been tied down in never ending rounds of consultations and studies and reports. It's as boring as watching paint dry, but it's kept a few issues off the backs of Irish bikers so far. That's not to say they wont happen eventually - they well might - but right now the only people putting the bikers perspective to the various quangos, committees and statutory bodies is MAG Ireland.

MAG is not for everyone. It would be naive to think it is. There's always someone who feels it should be done differently.

The stark reality is that if every biker in Ireland answered the likes 2030 vision consultation (www.2030vision.ie), and the others before it, and those yet to come, then MAG would be mostly unnecessary. I'm willing to bet that maybe 1% of the people reading this will actually go and read that consultation document, and maybe 1% of those will actually respond to it in some way.

You don't have to be a MAG member to make a difference, but it helps. I'll try to get an answer on the manhole covers thing at the meeting tomorrow.

CB_Phil
04-04-2011, 09:42 PM
thumbup.gif
Fair play for the reply. ill have a read on the site ect.
Would you not do similar to the uk outfit the way they run a page in 100% Biker or BSH (cant remember which), but it outlines what their doin, makes folk aware & Im sure gets new members. You could run it in Bike Buyers or somethin, aware it costs money, but it gets the word out

Hellraiser
04-04-2011, 09:44 PM
thumbup.gif
Fair play for the reply. ill have a read on the site ect.
Would you not do similar to the uk outfit the way they run a page in 100% Biker or BSH (cant remember which), but it outlines what their doin, makes folk aware & Im sure gets new members. You could run it in Bike Buyers or somethin, aware it costs money, but it gets the word out

Aye, tie in with Magnets here (and other forums) as he does a bit of writing for the BBG, he might be able to help.

carsQhere
04-04-2011, 09:47 PM
Fair point bot of yis. I'll bring it up at the meeting Tue night aswell, see what the story is.

Pryrates
05-04-2011, 12:23 AM
Fair point bot of yis. I'll bring it up at the meeting Tue night aswell, see what the story is.

Just a thought but from what I have seen in my short time biking lads are nearly always open to any excuse for a spin. If you were to organise a rally with camp sites etc and turn a protest into an more of an event would that not greatly increase numbers? Collect money for an associated charity. Perhaps through together a few figures of money raised in the last few years from bike related activities to give the press a nice catchy figure. Could even throw a few figures about road deaths since traffic cameras increased etc.

Again I know the logistics would be challenging but when charities benefit you will have no difficulty finding volunteers. Besides the odd comment this is the first time I have even heard of MAG and I'm reasonably active in biking circles.

carsQhere
06-04-2011, 11:26 AM
Right, spoke to Linda in MAG about this. No law in Ireland around slip/skid resistance of inspection covers in the roadway. Other rules surrounding fitness for purpose etc. may apply in some cases. There is a specific law in the UK though. If a cover presents a hazard report it to the relevant county or city council same as you would a pothole. Once notified, they are responsible for fixing it.

Running ads will be discussed at next board meeting.

MAG Ireland used to run the "Stop the Rot" rally. It became too much for a small band of volunteers to organise and run around the same time that insurance costs went through the roof and that killed it off. There's no realistic prospect of it making a comeback at this stage.

MAG is finalising our submission on the 2030 vision consultation document this week. We'll be publishing it on www.magireland.org after we submit it to the NTA. There'll be a post up about it too as there's a fair bit in it, so keep an eye out for that if you're interested.

carsQhere
11-04-2011, 03:19 PM
MAG Ireland has now published a formal response to the NTA Consultation on the MAG web site. See this post;
http://www.magireland.org/2011/responses/nta-response/

It runs to 37 pages, and it's not what you'd call a real page turner either, but worth a read for anybody who's interested.

Hellraiser
11-04-2011, 03:41 PM
I've actually read that with some bemusement....who the FUCK thinks this shit up??? They couldn't be more anti-biker if they tried!! As for the whole bus lane shite....it seems to be never-ending at this stage but what I laughed at the most...


Objection 1:

“Motorcycles are dangerous, we don’t want to encourage
them”

Come on!! Get real!! FFS it's SO frustrating!!

BTW, I didn't see any mention of tractors in there.... 25300.gif

carsQhere
11-04-2011, 05:50 PM
I've actually read that with some bemusement....who the FUCK thinks this shit up???

The National Transport Authority - it's their paid full time day job to come up with this kind of stuff.

“Motorcycles are dangerous, we don’t want to encourage them” is always the first line the authorities trot out when confronted with their own prejudice against us. In most cases they haven't thought it through. When they have, they'll be using the RSA casualty stats to justify their position.

One of the difficulties MAG comes up against in dealing with the likes of the RSA, NTA, NRA, Dept. of Transport etc. is that we're always starting from a position where we're seen as a problem. By contrast, cyclists, who have a similar risk profile to motorcyclists, are always seen as a solution. The net result is that to make any kind of progress we first have to overcome the "bikes are dangerous" bias.